Dr Illusion of Illusion of Sanity left a good link the other day. Usually I don’t bother with haters, other than to laugh at them, but this one is kind of hilarious in how badly it’s written and how much it ignores the way the world works.
Claims of Death
Apparently the Manosphere is still dying. Or at least this post claims it is and welcomes the death. That such a death will be best for the world.
I thoroughly disagree with both of those thoughts.
The post makes the manosphere out to be an enemy of everyone. It especially tries to target Roissy and Roosh, two of the founders, and tries to debunk them as relevant. First it tries to say “Oh, these are just normal guys, why does anyone listen to them?” without considering that they may have started out that way but then grown into more as they learned more and experienced more. They became important because they were able to both learn lessons and communicate these lessons to people online.
Then they try and attack the logic of the ‘Sphere as a whole.
In Roissy in DC (now Heartiste), Roissy took the extreme version of evo-psych alpha/beta scare tactics and added a combination of hard-right politics and Steve Sailor racial HBD science. Does this now sound completely incoherent to you? Welcome to the manosphere.
“But whenever evidence was presented to them, especially to Roissy, that guys who didn’t act this way also got chicks, the manosphere would backtrack and redefine the definition of alpha from a dominant caveman dude to that of a guy who can score lots of girls, regardless of looks and behavior”
Did someone expect ANY of the manosphere to come out fully formed? When you go searching for answers, do you not incorporate new information into your conclusions? If your conclusions are then shown to be partially wrong, do you not look for a new answer that is more correct than the old?
The strawmen here are numerous. If you try and whittle down Heartiste, or anyone’s writing, to a single sentence…. Yes it will sound inane. If you read it as a whole it will paint a picture that is not confusing as to their thoughts and ideas. – I would encourage you to examine it and find your own truths. To say nothing of the fact that each person writing in the ‘Sphere has a personal idea of what Alpha and game are (which is good – diversity and competition will find the truth).
Interestingly enough, he repeatedly claims that Roissy and Roosh advocate a ‘dominant caveman’ approach to women, though they’re both two of the most outspoken advocates for indirect game. Rarely do they even admit that a ‘thug mentality’ can go anywhere with women, that it usually is better to avoid that because it isn’t congruent with most men’s behavior.
He tries to cite men not getting laid at an all male event that was designed simply to have fun and meet each other as some failure of game. The Roosh meetup in DC. He missed the point of the meet up completely in that it was simply to have fun. Crazy concept, I know.
The last claim of proof he has of the ‘Sphere dying is that Roosh is ‘transitioning to a lifestyle blog’ (the Return of Kings link over in the side) and is distancing himself from Roissy style game and stopped believing in game. While he is writing that, he hasn’t stopped writing at his main site at all, and has said he won’t do so. He also has done no distancing. He has not stated he stopped believing in game. Yup, completely unfounded
But the Manosphere isn’t dying. To look at why, lets have a little refresher on a few things.
What Game Is
Badger wrote out a wonderful comment at Dalrocks latest post that very clearly and succinctly tells what the different aspects of game are. He boils it down to two aspects – things that directly affect how you do with women (micro game) and things that indirectly affect how you do with women (macro game)
“Micro-game” is how to tune/change your behavior to increase a woman’s attraction to you or to otherwise influence her behavior (and we’ve noticed that the best way to modify a woman’s behavior is to become more attractive). Behavior in this sense is basically verbal and body language, distinct from your fitness, paycheck, etc. This is “game” in the original sense of the word – a piece of a man’s personality that is orthogonal to the other parts and specifically addresses how he deals with women.
“Macro-game” is the overall structure of who is attractive and why, and all the ways you can change your attractiveness and the relationships around you. This involves not just your social skills but your life habits, your fitness, fashion sense, the trajectory of your life.
Micro-game is why two guys with basically the same look, lifestyle and job will get different results from women – one of them understands how to socially interact with women.
Macro-game is why jocks and frat guys get sex on speeddial while Poindexter in the library struggles to get a date.
Micro-game almost always leads to macro-game in a guy’s improvement plan, because better social skills can only take you so far if you don’t have an improved lifestyle to back it with.
The problem with anyone studying this from the viewpoint of someone new to game or new to the ‘Sphere, is that it hasn’t always been thought of this way. Here’s where claims that the changing definitions and viewpoints are a valid concern, but rather than a signal of death, they’re a signal of life.
Rough History of Game
One of Krauser’s latest posts details the growth of game theory and how it has evolved since it’s conception. It’s definitely worth the read, especially because I know many people romanticize early game stuff of Mystery and Style. The Game is considered a handbook to many, and I’ve gotten into arguments with some like Obsidian that treat it like the bible of game. Mystery’s book Mystery Method is solid, but still just an entry point. I’d recommend people read both of them if they’re new to game. To understand current writings best it’s necessary to go to the source text that spawned all of them.
But, for those of you that have no desire to do that much reading or no time, Krauser’s Game Theory Has It’s Own Life Cycle is damn good. Here’s a few summaries relevant to why game isn’t dead.
Mystery Method – Dubbed Aspy Game by Krauser
- Obsession with linear programming / engineering of secret systems that simply need to be learned and applied (e.g. the M3 model)
- Dogmatic literal interpretation of evolutionary biology
- Commodifying human interaction into programmable units that are endlessly sub-divisable (e.g the Opener, the forward stack, the roll-off)
- Dehumanising the participants as mere occupants of a social role such as PUA, HB, Wing, Cockblock, AFC, AMOG etc
Completely internal game – dubbed Mystical Game
- Obsession with rejecting and transgressing social norms (e.g. beasting, AA-busting pranks)
- An overestimation of internal state and it’s ability to suck people in, an underestimation of social structures and people’s stubborn insistence on clinging to them
- Fluid equivocating definitions of terms. It’s all a flow. Read more Tolle
- Self acceptance and living to your own values
- Reading the social matrix at the level of small groups of actors (e.g. in a club)
What is probably Half of the current Mainstream game – Alpha Asshole
- Obsession with sexual market rank, in particular to achieve Alpha and reject Beta
- An overestimation of people’s adversarial and self-interested intention to screw you over
- Humorous, non-PC, taboo-breaking definitions of people and their behaviour
- Embracing high self-regard
- Reading the social matrix at a macro-level (e.g. demographic trends)
The other half of what current mainstream game seems to be (and on the rise) – Galt Game
- Obsession with finding the mythical pussy paradise
- An overestimation of no-skill “hacks” and passive income, an underestimation of the need to have a real employable skill
- Glorification of freedom, travel and living life on your own terms
- Tension between laziness to get things easy, and genuine drive towards self-improvement (gym, grooming, wide reading etc)
- Dispensing with grand theory and looking to accumulate cliffs notes on “what works”
My Personal Beliefs
Honestly I fall between the asshole and whole view of Galt game. Though I’d probably call it Leadership Game, or simply Private Man’s dubbing of Charisma. No surprise seeing as I’ve come into it in the last year. This combination of views satisfies my innate urges to solve my own problems and have a complete self. To be well read, in shape, with a good balance of free time, a career I love, and enough money to support myself doing the things I want. To have a few women around to enjoy the life I’m building with me as it happens; unless I happen to find that one that I think would be worth the plunge and risk of commitment.
I feel like the new ideas of Game are changing to meet the goals of men my age that want those same things. Men my age starting to refuse to buy romanticized idealistic lies. We’d love to find that one person to have a family with. But we haven’t put anything into the system that makes us overly bitter. If I sleep around with women it’s not out of malicious intent, but I don’t care if they get hurt following the same script they chose either.
And if I hit a dry period, such as what I’m in right now, I’m not all that concerned either. I’m concentrating on me and that is satisfying for now. I feel healthier and happier than ever. I still get numbers and make outs. I have fun, make stories, and work towards my goals. I still work to achieve more in all aspects of my life.
I still have hope.
I find the hope in my own actions. Actions chosen because of the examples of men I’ve met in this corner of the internet of how to get what I want while avoiding the traps society sets for men. Actions chosen with the aid and guidance of the manosphere.
And as long as it gives men hope and goals of self improvement, the manosphere will never die.